From the Orthodox media:
“We need to leave the Kiddush club in place.”
Those weren’t the exact words I used, but it was the message I conveyed to the president of my shul, who wanted to shut down the Kiddush club.
Substance abuse is a real and growing issue, not only in Orthodox Jewish communities, but across the country. We do ourselves a disservice when we say that Kiddush clubs are the problem, as it obscures the fact that substance abuse is part of a national trend and prevents us from learning from national findings and recommendations. Additionally, the excessive drinking in frum society is not limited to men taking a break during shul, as it does not only take place in shul, nor is it limited to men. I felt then and still feel today that taking a break during davening for a l’chayim is far from ideal, but shutting down the Kiddush club would be only an illusory victory against a problem that is in reality far more insidious.
We had discussion groups but struggled to find a middle ground. I delivered drashos on the topic of the shvil hazahav, the golden mean, and the Rambam’s insistence on balancing ascetism with gluttony, especially as it pertains to alcohol. I spoke about the need to drink responsibly, about being good role models to our children, about distinguishing between addiction and an occasional drink, and most importantly, how alcoholism and other addictions are often symptomatic of deeper struggles that need to be addressed.
..... I agree, shul is not the place for drinking. But what is a shul? Of course, a shul is a place to daven, but there’s an opportunity in this communal space to teach and model what a healthy community should look like. Is a shul setting, where best practices can be developed and enforced, not better suited for healthy drinking than the house next door, where the drinking knows no bounds?
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I [E.E.] must be missing something!!! Forget about the alcoholism part. How does a shul/rabbi officially permit men to leave during Krias HaTorah [or the Haftorah]. It is a bizayon HaTorah. [If they miss the Rabbi's drasha then it is בזיון תלמידי חכמים in addition to בזיון התורה. I am zocheh give a drasha on Shabbos after the davening and I weekly enjoy it as people quickly scatter for the exit so they don't have to hear me for ten minutes or so. HUMBLING!!! 😃]. Dvar Hashem is going to be read in shul and men knowingly walk out in advance in order to engage in their gluttony, leitzanus and kalus rosh [three things I must admit I am guilty of myself at times - may Hashem in His great compassion forgive me]. Even if it would be for a Gemara shiur it would be totally inappropriate. Chazal decreed that we read the Torah every Shabbos and as Torah observant Jews that is what we do.
If an individual decides that he doesn't want to hear Krias HaTorah that is his prerogative. Free country. We can't force people to be good Jews. But how can shul policy permit a public desecration of Krias HaTorah???
A wonder.-------------
I just found this:
There was someone who had walked out of the sanctuary of the shul to where the other men were making kiddush. This time, however, someone began to berate him:
“You don’t come here to daven! You come here to drink and to talk!”
This vignette would normally be unremarkable, except for the fact that the person doing the berating was the shul’s Hispanic custodian. The story is not apocryphal – it genuinely happened.
What we are concerned about, however, is not the berating per se, but rather the halacha behind walking out in the first place.
The man was walking into the shul’s unofficial “Kiddush Club.”
A Kiddush Club is when people walk out of shul before the Rabbi’s speech or before the haftorah – in order to make kiddush on wine or schnapps and socialize.
The proliferation of Kiddush clubs is so great that there was article about it in Newsweek during the summer of 2004. There is even a Wikipedia entry on the subject. After a definition the article notes:
“The practice was criticized by the Orthodox Union (OU) in December 2004, when the OU called for the elimination of such practices. OU Executive Vice President Rabbi Dr. Tzvi Hersh Weinreb criticized “Kiddush Clubs” for detracting from the honor of the synagogue, promoting gossip (lashon hara), and leading participants to return to services in a state of intoxication (which are violations of Jewish Law), reducing decorum, and enabling the problem of substance abuse.”
Aside from the five points Rabbi Weinreb mentions – there is the sixth issue of Kavod HaTorah – the honor of Torah itself – namely – the Rabbi who is giving his drasha.
KAVOD HATORAH
Although we know that there is nothing greater than the study of Torah, we find something fascinating in Meseches Megillah (3b). There it states that kavod haTorah – honoring Torah is greater than limud haTorah – the study of Torah. If a Talmid Chochom dies on Purim we eulogize him even if it will mean that we will be unable to hear the Megillah!
The Derech Chaim on Pirkei Avos 6:3 demonstrates clearly that Kavod HaTorah is greater than the honor that must be given kings.
Rav Ovadiah Yoseph zt”l notes that in our generation (Yechaveh Daas VI #49), Kavod haTorah has already fallen ten flights down.
The Rosh explains in Nedarim 22b that even after the Beis HaMikdash was destroyed women continued to go up to Yerushalayim on the three regalim in order to hear Torah. Even though they are exempt from Torah study they went up because of Kavod haTorah.
The Gemorah is filled with illustrations of people who did not exit during a Torah discourse to use the facilities and suffered medical repercussions based on this. The reason that they did not leave was because of Kavod HaTorah.
In recent years, many shuls have reacted in different ways to kiddush clubs. Some have tried banning them altogether. This has had mixed results. Since many of the participants are from the more powerful members of the congregation, the Rabbis have had a hard time eliminating them.
